ALD?

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  • HaffnerHaffner Posts: 7,886
    I saw Viv on the LiL and Sacred Heart tours. Glad I did, cause that guy is gone.

    Green with envy here. I wish I could have seen that. I was probably still playing with my Masters of the Universe toys back then.

    Snoogans said:

    I saw DefLep on the Hysteria tour. Phil was on fire that night - Monster shredding, throwing big shapes, crazy custom Jacksons. Proper guitar hero stuff.
    Steve Clark?  Coolest mofo in the room, and he knew it!

    I have seen that live on the round video they did from that tour. 30 seconds in, it's clear Clark was the MVP in that band. Hysteria is when they lost it for me, but losing him was the real death blow for DL.


    I LOVE High and Dry and really like Pyromania. If I remember correctly, "Women" was the first video from Hysteria and I thought that was pretty good. Then I was embarrassed when a girlfriend of mine played the rest, I thought it was really sterile and bloodless (I played it off so I could cuddle with her later lol). I found Adrenalize even worse.

    But to be fair, it was the production on Hysteria and Animalize that I felt made the end product especially cold. Even  song that wasn't half bad, like Love Bites, was sucked dry of any humanity.

    But that's just my opinion, I know and respect many fans of that album. I thought it stunk on ice.
  • Tatosh GuitarTatosh Guitar Posts: 1,894
    Haffner said:

    I LOVE High and Dry and really like Pyromania. If I remember correctly, "Women" was the first video from Hysteria and I thought that was pretty good. Then I was embarrassed when a girlfriend of mine played the rest, I thought it was really sterile and bloodless (I played it off so I could cuddle with her later lol). I found Adrenalize even worse.

    But to be fair, it was the production on Hysteria and Animalize that I felt made the end product especially cold. Even  song that wasn't half bad, like Love Bites, was sucked dry of any humanity.

    But that's just my opinion, I know and respect many fans of that album. I thought it stunk on ice.

    Most of us here are gonna agree with this. The production in Hysteria is the perfect example of everything that was wrong with the 80's.

    It was designed for the Michael Jackson and Madonna crowd, not for the NWOBHM fans. It succeded at that.  a lot of my female friends my age still love it to death. I can tolerate it, and I suppose it's better than what's on the airwaves these days.

    But to me, the real DL is High N' Dry, which I still love, and Pyromania, which is cool. Steve Clark and Pete Willis were getting great guitat tone back then, on par with Maiden or Saxon.
  • HaffnerHaffner Posts: 7,886
    edited February 7
    Haffner said:

    I LOVE High and Dry and really like Pyromania. If I remember correctly, "Women" was the first video from Hysteria and I thought that was pretty good. Then I was embarrassed when a girlfriend of mine played the rest, I thought it was really sterile and bloodless (I played it off so I could cuddle with her later lol). I found Adrenalize even worse.

    But to be fair, it was the production on Hysteria and Animalize that I felt made the end product especially cold. Even  song that wasn't half bad, like Love Bites, was sucked dry of any humanity.

    But that's just my opinion, I know and respect many fans of that album. I thought it stunk on ice.

    Most of us here are gonna agree with this. The production in Hysteria is the perfect example of everything that was wrong with the 80's.

    It was designed for the Michael Jackson and Madonna crowd, not for the NWOBHM fans. It succeded at that.  a lot of my female friends my age still love it to death. I can tolerate it, and I suppose it's better than what's on the airwaves these days.

    But to me, the real DL is High N' Dry, which I still love, and Pyromania, which is cool. Steve Clark and Pete Willis were getting great guitat tone back then, on par with Maiden or Saxon.
    Looking back it seems my disillusionment from the band happened not long after its inclusion of Collen. 

    But, to be perfectly honest the only guitar solo I ever even really liked by Def Leppard was Bringing on the Heartbreak, especially the outro. I think that was Clark. To me Def Leppard at their best were like a more youthful, naïve (and ultimately not as good) AC/DC, with a side helping of maybe a little UFO, Wishbone Ash, and perhaps even the more streamlined songs from Bonnet-era Rainbow. They were never exactly groundbreaking...and in my humble opinion they certainly never rocked as hard as Angus and co.

    I take that back...they had a lot on influence of the MTV-bred Hair bands to follow. Which mostly sucked, imo. Hysteria, Slip of the Tongue and Turbo were the albums that had me appreciating bands like Slayer, Bathory, Death, Testament, and Kreator a lot. Only G n R kept me Dino grounded back then.
    Post edited by Haffner on
  • Haffner said:
    Haffner said:

    I LOVE High and Dry and really like Pyromania. If I remember correctly, "Women" was the first video from Hysteria and I thought that was pretty good. Then I was embarrassed when a girlfriend of mine played the rest, I thought it was really sterile and bloodless (I played it off so I could cuddle with her later lol). I found Adrenalize even worse.

    But to be fair, it was the production on Hysteria and Animalize that I felt made the end product especially cold. Even  song that wasn't half bad, like Love Bites, was sucked dry of any humanity.

    But that's just my opinion, I know and respect many fans of that album. I thought it stunk on ice.

    Most of us here are gonna agree with this. The production in Hysteria is the perfect example of everything that was wrong with the 80's.

    It was designed for the Michael Jackson and Madonna crowd, not for the NWOBHM fans. It succeded at that.  a lot of my female friends my age still love it to death. I can tolerate it, and I suppose it's better than what's on the airwaves these days.

    But to me, the real DL is High N' Dry, which I still love, and Pyromania, which is cool. Steve Clark and Pete Willis were getting great guitat tone back then, on par with Maiden or Saxon.
    Looking back it seems my disillusionment from the band happened not long after its inclusion of Collen. 

    But, to be perfectly honest the only guitar solo I ever even really liked by Def Leppard was Bringing on the Heartbreak, especially the outro. I think that was Clark. To me Def Leppard at their best were like a more youthful, naïve (and ultimately not as good) AC/DC, with a side helping of maybe a little UFO, Wishbone Ash, and perhaps even the more streamlined songs from Bonnet-era Rainbow. They were never exactly groundbreaking...and in my humble opinion they certainly never rocked as hard as Angus and co.

    I take that back...they had a lot on influence of the MTV-bred Hair bands to follow. Which mostly sucked, imo. Hysteria, Slip of the Tongue and Turbo were the albums that had me appreciating bands like Slayer, Bathory, Death, Testament, and Kreator a lot. Only G n R kept me Dino grounded back then.
    Hysteria has its moments,  but totally love Pyromania , fantastic album all round. After that zero.
  • Duojett71Duojett71 Posts: 9,452
    edited February 8
    Haffner said:
    Haffner said:

    I LOVE High and Dry and really like Pyromania. If I remember correctly, "Women" was the first video from Hysteria and I thought that was pretty good. Then I was embarrassed when a girlfriend of mine played the rest, I thought it was really sterile and bloodless (I played it off so I could cuddle with her later lol). I found Adrenalize even worse.

    But to be fair, it was the production on Hysteria and Animalize that I felt made the end product especially cold. Even  song that wasn't half bad, like Love Bites, was sucked dry of any humanity.

    But that's just my opinion, I know and respect many fans of that album. I thought it stunk on ice.

    Most of us here are gonna agree with this. The production in Hysteria is the perfect example of everything that was wrong with the 80's.

    It was designed for the Michael Jackson and Madonna crowd, not for the NWOBHM fans. It succeded at that.  a lot of my female friends my age still love it to death. I can tolerate it, and I suppose it's better than what's on the airwaves these days.

    But to me, the real DL is High N' Dry, which I still love, and Pyromania, which is cool. Steve Clark and Pete Willis were getting great guitat tone back then, on par with Maiden or Saxon.
    Looking back it seems my disillusionment from the band happened not long after its inclusion of Collen. 

    But, to be perfectly honest the only guitar solo I ever even really liked by Def Leppard was Bringing on the Heartbreak, especially the outro. I think that was Clark. To me Def Leppard at their best were like a more youthful, naïve (and ultimately not as good) AC/DC, with a side helping of maybe a little UFO, Wishbone Ash, and perhaps even the more streamlined songs from Bonnet-era Rainbow. They were never exactly groundbreaking...and in my humble opinion they certainly never rocked as hard as Angus and co.

    I take that back...they had a lot on influence of the MTV-bred Hair bands to follow. Which mostly sucked, imo. Hysteria, Slip of the Tongue and Turbo were the albums that had me appreciating bands like Slayer, Bathory, Death, Testament, and Kreator a lot. Only G n R kept me Dino grounded back then.
    Pete Willis plays his ass off on 'High And Dry'.....especially on the title track. Clark was good on the first album and on 'Pyromania'.....but I don't really care for his solos on for me is the best DL album 'High and Dry'. Not crazy about his lead tone on that record either. "Bringing On The Heartbreak" is probably his best leadwork on that record. Clark pulls out the same few tricks on just about every solo on that what. Willis reminded me of a little flashier version of Angus Young. To this day I would still rate Pete Willis as the best DL guitarist of all time. I don't count Vivian because as much as a fan I am of his....his recorded output with the band does not count.
    Post edited by Duojett71 on
  • Tatosh GuitarTatosh Guitar Posts: 1,894
    Haffner said:


    But, to be perfectly honest the only guitar solo I ever even really liked by Def Leppard was Bringing on the Heartbreak, especially the outro. I think that was Clark. To me Def Leppard at their best were like a more youthful, naïve (and ultimately not as good) AC/DC, with a side helping of maybe a little UFO, Wishbone Ash, and perhaps even the more streamlined songs from Bonnet-era Rainbow. They were never exactly groundbreaking...and in my humble opinion they certainly never rocked as hard as Angus and co.

    You hit it straight in the head. When I hear High N Dry, and specially Bringing on the Heartbreak, I get this feeling of innocence. It's hard to describe, but it sounds like something a bunch of kids would do, at least to me. Or maybe it's because I was a kid myself when I discovered that album, and it sounds different to the work of other bands, like Priest or Purple, who were older and more experienced players. Anyway I love that song, specially the solo. Clark was a cool dude.

    The AC/DC thing it's hard to ignore. I was wonder if that was Lange, who was fressh from producing Back in Black and the like back then...

    Duojett71 said:

    I don't count Vivian because as much as a fan I am of his....his recorded output with the band does not count.

    This is so true it's downright infuriating. The dude doesn't even try...

  • Duojett71Duojett71 Posts: 9,452
    Haffner said:


    But, to be perfectly honest the only guitar solo I ever even really liked by Def Leppard was Bringing on the Heartbreak, especially the outro. I think that was Clark. To me Def Leppard at their best were like a more youthful, naïve (and ultimately not as good) AC/DC, with a side helping of maybe a little UFO, Wishbone Ash, and perhaps even the more streamlined songs from Bonnet-era Rainbow. They were never exactly groundbreaking...and in my humble opinion they certainly never rocked as hard as Angus and co.

    You hit it straight in the head. When I hear High N Dry, and specially Bringing on the Heartbreak, I get this feeling of innocence. It's hard to describe, but it sounds like something a bunch of kids would do, at least to me. Or maybe it's because I was a kid myself when I discovered that album, and it sounds different to the work of other bands, like Priest or Purple, who were older and more experienced players. Anyway I love that song, specially the solo. Clark was a cool dude.

    The AC/DC thing it's hard to ignore. I was wonder if that was Lange, who was fressh from producing Back in Black and the like back then...

    Duojett71 said:

    I don't count Vivian because as much as a fan I am of his....his recorded output with the band does not count.

    This is so true it's downright infuriating. The dude doesn't even try...

    well....in his defense.....being a guitar hero in Def Leppard is not his job....at lest not on the albums he records with them. DL are not that type of band and Vivian does what he was hired to do.
  • Tatosh GuitarTatosh Guitar Posts: 1,894
    Duojett71 said:

    well....in his defense.....being a guitar hero in Def Leppard is not his job....at lest not on the albums he records with them. DL are not that type of band and Vivian does what he was hired to do.
    This is true. Like Priest or Maiden, Leppard is about the sum of the parts, getting the job done. It's not about an individual player. I am old enough to accept I hadn't seen it that way...

  • This is true. Like Priest or Maiden, Leppard is about the sum of the parts, getting the job done. It's not about an individual player. I am old enough to accept I hadn't seen it that way...

    Yeah, I've never thought of Leppard as a "guitar band" ala Lizzy, Priest, or Maiden -- which is why there's no Alchemy profiles of Clark or Collen.  They're really a song-band -- which on one hand is great, but (compared to the others I mentioned) there are no real guitar hero moments in DL.  And having a neutered version of Campbell kept it that way.  Too much $$ being made to have changed the formula. Good thing they got Viv after the ALD kicked in and he no longer gave a shit about soloing. The Dio-aged, Gary-worshipping Viv would have not fit that bill. 



    In the midst of the sort of general malaise that only the genius possess and the insane lament.
  • HaffnerHaffner Posts: 7,886
    The Dio-aged, Gary-worshipping Viv would have not fit that bill. 



    But...what if he had changed the DL sound BACK to the more edgy, High n Dry? I realize these are flagrant intangibles, but I so liked that band back in their HnD days. I thought they had so much promise...to me, Viv would have made that band even better, probably added more fast tunes.

    Or maybe I'm cuckoo lol.
  • Tatosh GuitarTatosh Guitar Posts: 1,894
    edited February 12
    Haffner said:
    But...what if he had changed the DL sound BACK to the more edgy, High n Dry? I realize these are flagrant intangibles, but I so liked that band back in their HnD days. I thought they had so much promise...to me, Viv would have made that band even better, probably added more fast tunes.

    Or maybe I'm cuckoo lol.
    The chance of that ever happening post Hysteria is borderline non-existant. That album was enourmous, and basically dictated the audience that was gonna follow them for the rest of their career.

    Joe Elliot always said they had more in common with Bowie or Queen than with Sabbath or Purple, anyway.

    Post edited by Tatosh Guitar on
  • eduardoritoseduardoritos Posts: 3,590
    Pyromania very good guitar moments, into a song contrxt. Trading flashy Collen with tasty Clark. Insteresting guitar passages and arrangemdnt. Some good riff and guitar tones way better than any post Pyro album (and, for my guts, even previous albums).

    On Viv. 
    We, the fans, want to shredder Viv. 
    He, needs a job and he'd evolved to a different playing, at the same time. DL came in the right moment for him. 
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