One of the Best Black Sabbath Songs

HaffnerHaffner Posts: 7,804
edited December 1969 in Songwriting
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Comments

  • AgrippaAgrippa Posts: 5,872
    No Argument here.

    As long as I can classify "The Shining", "Wishing Well", "Zero The Hero" and "Megalomania" as some of their best too.
  • HaffnerHaffner Posts: 7,804
    [quote author=Agrippa link=topic=15358.msg233506#msg233506 date=1372425627]
    No Argument here.

    As long as I can classify "The Shining", "Wishing Well", "Zero The Hero" and "Megalomania" as some of their best too.
    [/quote]


    I LOVE those songs :up:

    I put this topic up not just because I believe it to be true, but because I was curious if anyone would bite in regard as to why it's one of the best, and possibly even the best in terms of...
  • Seven MoonsSeven Moons Posts: 8,701
    One of their most interesting songs for sure. They've never sounded so close to prog rock. They obviously wanted to experiment, and they succeeded IMO.  When I heard it for the first time, I suddenly found some logic in Tony's brief common past with Jethro Tull, because his leadwork on that song reminds me of Martin Barre's playing. The interaction with the keyboards on the outro sounds like he wanted to show that he had unexpected refinement and subtlety in his bag of tricks.
  • HaffnerHaffner Posts: 7,804
    [quote author=Seven Moons link=topic=15358.msg233514#msg233514 date=1372427917]
    One of their most interesting songs for sure. They've never sounded so close to prog rock. They obviously wanted to experiment, and they succeeded IMO.  When I heard it for the first time, I suddenly found some logic in Tony's brief common past with Jethro Tull, because his leadwork on that song reminds me of Martin Barre's playing. The interaction with the keyboards on the outro sounds like he wanted to show that he had unexpected refinement and subtlety in his bag of tricks.
    [/quote]


    +1 really cool, Vincent.
  • SkyeSkye Posts: 1,660
    Yea this album gets a lot of hate - but there's good stuff on here, I like it.

    Why do you feel that way about this particular song Haff?
  • HaffnerHaffner Posts: 7,804
    [quote author=Skye link=topic=15358.msg233516#msg233516 date=1372429128]
    Yea this album gets a lot of hate - but there's good stuff on here, I like it.

    Why do you feel that way about this particular song Haff?
    [/quote]

    Sabbath never got as experimental as they did on Air Dance. In that sense, from a purely musical standpoint it's possibly the best thing they ever did, and I tend to get ugly whenever I read about Osbourne and Iommi disparaging it.

    The performances themselves are both fantastic and anomalous; Osbourne at several points actually sounds beautiful (!), and keep in mind this is a couple of years after he blew out his voice on "Sabotage".

    The great pity is, they never ever came close to such successful, interesting, engaging experimentation again.

    Or maybe I'm wrong :036:
  • SkyeSkye Posts: 1,660
    No, I'd say that's a good and fair assessment.

    I always loved the title track....super poppy for them, but I've always loved that song!
  • HaffnerHaffner Posts: 7,804
    [quote author=Skye link=topic=15358.msg233524#msg233524 date=1372434540]
    No, I'd say that's a good and fair assessment.

    I always loved the title track....super poppy for them, but I've always loved that song!
    [/quote]

    Me too! I love the whole album (except "Breakout" which was just too out there for me, still respect it for trying something different).

    Speaking of trying something different, listen to the song structure of "Shock Wave". Ozzy's voice at a couple of points almost sounded Frampton-ian on that one, at least to me.
  • AgrippaAgrippa Posts: 5,872
    It's funny, I know reviewers disliked this album, I even remember a Danish reviewer back in 1978 writing that the title should be "Now We Must Die", but among people who actually like Black Sabbath I seldom come across any who doesn't have some love for this album.
    I've heard more "fans" disliking Technical Ecstasy and Born Again.

    Myself, I've always really loved "Never Say Die".

    Johnny Blade, Juniors Eyes and Swinging The Chain are along with Air Dance just awesome tracks.
    What' s not to love ?

    The rest aren't that bad either.

  • Seven MoonsSeven Moons Posts: 8,701
    I never understood all the hate either. This a MUCH better album than Technical Ecstasy IMO. I love Junior's Eyes, the title track, Johnny Blade, Shock Wave and Air Dance. Over to You and Hard Road are not bad. The only ones I don't like are Breakout and Swinging the Chain.
  • AgrippaAgrippa Posts: 5,872
    I never understood Breakout either. But I always regarded it as an intermezzo or intro, something you could skip, like fx from vol 4.
    Swinging the chain imo has some great guitar riffs and I really like Bill Wards singing and screaming on that one.

    BTW it just occured to me, Never Say Die is one of only two album I have on CD, Vinyl and MC. So I must have some love for it.
    And no, I'm not Patrick Bateman
    The other one is BOCs "Some Enchanted Evening".
  • HaffnerHaffner Posts: 7,804
    [quote author=Seven Moons link=topic=15358.msg233543#msg233543 date=1372457030]
    I never understood all the hate either. This a MUCH better album than Technical Ecstasy IMO. I love Junior's Eyes, the title track, Johnny Blade, Shock Wave and Air Dance. Over to You and Hard Road are not bad. The only ones I don't like are Breakout and Swinging the Chain.
    [/quote]

    Breakout...like I said, I admire their attempt to do something different. But that track didn't drag anything down for me. I think I also mentioned that Never Say Die was my first Sabbath album, I saw a full page ad for it in Creem back when it came out (at the time I was big into the Stones and Who), bought it and said "Boy Howdy!" (apologies to people who don't get the inside joke). In fact, loved it so much that when I bought my 2nd Sabbath (Heaven and Hell) a couple years later, I caught myself playing them both as a twofer still (yes people, I love H and H more, I'm not that coy!).

    I remember that, as a preteen boy with an at times violently abusive household, a song like Hard Road really helped and offered hope. Great song imo. People just come down in it because it wasn't Paranoid. I love that I was able to hear NSD before Paranoid, and thus appreciate it for what it was.

    I like the solos on You Won't Change Me, and Dirty Women is killer. You can just throw out the rest of Technical Ecstasy, I haven't owned that album in decades. I thought the underdogs like Born Again and Seventh Star blew that one away.
  • Sun Red SunSun Red Sun Posts: 476
    [quote author=Agrippa link=topic=15358.msg233529#msg233529 date=1372440271]
    It's funny, I know reviewers disliked this album, I even remember a Danish reviewer back in 1978 writing that the title should be "Now We Must Die", but among people who actually like Black Sabbath I seldom come across any who doesn't have some love for this album.
    I've heard more "fans" disliking Technical Ecstasy and Born Again.

    Myself, I've always really loved "Never Say Die".

    Johnny Blade, Juniors Eyes and Swinging The Chain are along with Air Dance just awesome tracks.
    What' s not to love ?

    The rest aren't that bad either.

    [/quote]

    I absolutely follow Agrippa in his opinion. You can count me in to the list of the guys who don't get that hate spill over "Never Say Die". I always had a soft spot for this LP and despite the fact of all the bad circumstances surrounding it - I take it as the great record, just because most of it tracks are so enjoyable to return to. Mine favourite off the album is "Junior's Eyes" - these flanged chords leading into verses, ducking like stones thrown over water surface are just great... The band is tight and the drive is there, great groove.
  • Is Zappa playing the solo? :mrhappy: Similar tone and chops to Frank's here.
  • OskyOsky Posts: 1,043
    [quote author=eduardoritos link=topic=15358.msg238200#msg238200 date=1379928314]
    Is Zappa playing the solo? :mrhappy: Similar tone and chops to Frank's here.
    [/quote]Spot on! tone, phrasing everything!
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